When journalist Ilyssa Panitz went through her divorce, she had no idea what to expect. It was as if lawyers and judges were speaking a different language. At one point, the judge asked her if she understood what was happening, and she could barely answer him. She went to media, she went to Google. And she could not find a journalist that was distilling down topics around divorce. so that everyday people could understand. Like many of us, she reinvented herself during COVID, and became a divorce journalist.
Ilyssa believes knowledge is empowering. By translating the complex language of divorce through her columns, radio show, and podcast, she helps people going through the divorce process understand topics. They feel empowered and prepared to answer questions.
Ilyssa explains why the first step to take when getting a divorce is not to find a good attorney, it's to get on top of your finances. That's where a CDFA, or Certified Divorce Financial Analyst.
Today's guest wants you to learn from her mistakes. She'll feel successful if her errors can help others from making the same ones. As she says, she wants you to survive and thrive.
Ilyssa explains she's not your divorce attorney, CPA, or PhD. She's your "Waze," your "GPS" through the process. And it really came full circle for her with both of her kids. When they had friends going through divorce, they came to their Mom, because she helps people through this process.
To connect with Ilyssa, her articles, her shows, and more, find her at https://www.ilyssapanitz.com/
Need help with your financial future? Learn more about Paula and her work at PaulaChristine.com or send her an email: Paula@PaualChristine.com
Paula: Welcome to Beyond the Paycheck. I'm Paula Christine. Stop living paycheck to paycheck and start living the life that you dream about by taking control of your money. I can provide you with the knowledge and the tools, if you make the commitment to put them into practice. Most of you know, probably know, I got divorced about a year and a half ago, and it was a very difficult time in my life.
And Ilyssa Panitz, who's our guest today, is a divorce journalist and she is committed to helping others navigate that major life transition by exploring every topic when it comes to divorce. Her podcast and the articles that she writes are so informative. She has a show called The Divorce Hour with Ilyssa Panitz. This airs weekly on CRN Digital Talk Radio. So I know Ilyssa, we talked yesterday about what we were gonna talk about. And one thing that I honor you for is that you really dive deep into divorce and what people should be looking for, and how to avoid a lot of the mistakes that most of us make.
So what was one of the biggest things that you learned when you started talking about this topic?
Ilyssa: Just that all the mistakes I made.
Paula: You made?
Ilyssa: Oh my God. It's really a big focus and really what prompted me to do it. In addition, I have been a journalist my whole life and I turned to my industry for information because Googling is so overwhelming.
How to divorce, what kind of divorce, how to find a lawyer. I mean, it was just all so overwhelming. And we streamline information and we communicate information as journalists, I said, oh my God, I'll just turn to my industry, and turn to the person who does it. And no matter what time of day I turned on the news, no matter how many times I clicked and channel surfed, that one person came.
So when my job went south during Covid, I was in the middle of a horrific, horrific divorce, and my attorney was calling and had another question about something I had no knowledge of. In a fit of frustration, I threw everything off my desk and I realized there was a void, and divorce is all about reinvention.
COVID, for a lot of people, was all about reinvention. There were too many signs that it was a good time to reinvent, and create something that was not there. I wanted to fill a void. And as you said, journalists are all about sharing information, and that's exactly what I do as a journalist. I'm trained to be, and I say this in a good way, a scatterbrain, meaning I see something unfolding on the news, and that may be what's happening now, but I've gotta scatter that a million different ways.
And all those different ways are going to be new angles that I'm going to tell you that story to bring you new information. That's what I do with divorce.
Paula: And there really is nobody talking about it. I mean, you are the only person I know that talks about divorce and the tips and tools that you share are just so valuable to anybody who's thinking about divorce or even going through divorce.
Ilyssa: Well, divorce is overwhelming. There's the legal aspect out of it, and I remember sitting in court. And the judge looked at me and said, do you understand what's going on? And I said, no, I, I, I don't. And I kept stumbling on those words and I said, you're talking in a language I don't understand. Again, as journalists, we have to talk to an everybody audience.
And when you're going through a divorce, it's a very distinct audience. And I would say most people don't talk that language. And then you talk to a financial expert such as yourself. And again, you're talking in language, not you necessarily, we don't understand. And then all these people get involved in our lives and they're asking us all these questions.
We don't understand. What I'm doing is now I am putting it in a form where you can understand. And what I have learned since I've been doing this is when people start to understand. We are educating them. When you are educated and you are learning about something, you are building up your confidence, and when we build up your confidence, you feel empowered.
And when you can feel empowered and go into this where you feel so vulnerable, guess what? People can now sit there and I get the feedback all the time. Ilyssa, somebody said this, this, and this. I read that in your column. I knew what that meant and I knew how to answer the question. And I'm getting teary right now because we're helping people.
I'm helping people and we are taking all the language that you're gonna hear. We're just breaking it up into, what I call English. Into ways that you can, and I use the word over and over, understand what's going on so you can make better and smarter decisions for yourself and for your family.
Paula: So if someone comes to you and then says, you know, I'm considering getting a divorce, what is the first thing that you would say they need to do?
Ilyssa: Usually, and I get this question pretty much on a daily basis. Ilyssa, I'm getting a divorce, can you help me find a lawyer? I say, no, I'm going to help you find somebody to talk about your finance. One person said, Ugh, I heard it's all about the money. They all want my money. I said, well, don't you want your money?
You need to know about what you have, what debts there may be that you potentially could be on the hook for. Do you know what accounts you have? Brokerage accounts, bank accounts, credit cards. Do you know all the credit cards? Are all those credit cards paid off? Do you understand what the balances are?
Do you know your mortgage? Do you know where your mortgage is? What's on your mortgage? Have you done the title search on your house? People start looking at me. I said, it's okay. The way you're looking at me is the way I look when I was asked all these questions. You need to have all this information.
When you go into the attorney, the attorney's job is to be your advocate. And they can't be your advocate and fight for the things you're entitled for and the things that you want, if you're sending them down a black hole. They need this information. It is vital. It is, as you know from your experience in your line of work, it is one of the biggest components of a divorce.
Yes, there's the kids if you have minors, but the custody and the visitation might change multiple times over the course of when the kids emancipate out. The money cannot be changed. So you need to pay attention to it, and you need to understand it not only now when you're divorced, but after. When you are on your own and you've got to pay your own bills, maybe get a mortgage, maybe you have to start paying rent.
Maybe you have to apply for things. Do you understand how to do that? Do you understand if your credit has been damaged, how you may have to build that back? That is why it is crucial they work with somebody such as your. Or other financial professionals in the industry. I tell people to look for those who have the credentials of a CDFA, a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst.
When people ask me what a CDFA is, I say a Certified Divorce financial analyst. Think of it this way. They are like a matrimonial accountant, a divorce accountant. You need somebody who understands the money aspect in a divorce and they are specially credentialed to know how to look for it and how to help you.
Paula: I know even when I was going through my divorce being in the financial industry, I hired a CDFA to work with. Because I was emotional about the situation and I needed her to look at things logically for me to help me make the decision on what I wanted to see in the final results for the divorce. I mean, they're key.
Ilyssa: I didn't even know what a CDFA was during my divorce. I learned about it when I started doing my columns and somebody pitched it to me. and they said, you should interview my client who's a CDFA? They're perfect. I said, who wha wha wha?. Yeah. They said a CDFA. I didn't even understood what it stand for.
I started Googling. I'm like, how did I not know about this in my own divorce? Again, mistake. So this is where I always tell people, learn from my mistakes. You want me to talk about my mistakes? You want me to rehash all this? Because if I can help you avoid making them, and you tell me all the time and money and aggravation you saved as a result of learning from my mistakes. I am telling you, you have just made my day and you will pay it forward until the next person. And that's how we can help people. And Paula, you've been on the show a number of times, so you've heard me say the words survive and thrive, and that's what we want people to do.
This is a difficult time. It's a difficult transition, but you need to look ahead. And ahead is surviving and thriving, and you can do this by lessening those mistakes.
Paula: You do write that article in, it's in what Authority Magazine. Is that correct? Your Survive and Thrive?
Ilyssa: Correct. So it started out as Five Tips to Survive and Thrive.
And the column has since evolved because yes, we wanna teach you about surviving and thriving, but there's so much more education that people find invaluable. So today, We have the Tom Brady, Giselle Bunchen divorce, and Tom Brady has cryptically, if you wanna call it that, spoken out about not, not putting it bluntly out there about his personal life and he kind of is weaving it into what it means to be part of a team and play the game, and all this other stuff.
But, mental health is a big thing, especially with men. Men are supposed to be macho and oh, divorce doesn't affect us. It does, and we're talking about that. We have another one that talks about all types of celebrity divorces where people have to go into parenting courses to learn how to co-parent with the other side, especially when emotions are so high, and people are really now not seeing eye to eye on certain issues. We're talking about how to create a new budget for the holidays. We're in holiday season. Or how to get through the holidays, with Thanksgiving, which kicks off the holiday season. And it's a very difficult time for those going through a divorce. So there were so many topics that this column started taking on, and we found that the feedback from people was they really loved so much of the substance.
So we devoted more to either bouncing off the news, spring boarding off the news, or finding things that people are dealing with could be from their situations. Things that I hear about and bringing those into the spotlight and having experts such as yourself and other people really explain to people what happens if you find yourself in these situations and giving people more value.
Paula: Even having gone through my divorce, I still, like you did, I made some mistakes and then I've learned a lot from you, and your guests on your radio show that I wish I would've known.
Ilyssa: I learned so much from them. Which is crazy. And I remind people, I am not your attorney. I am not your CDFA, your CPA or your PhD.
I am just your Waze, I'm your GPS. My job as the journalist is to communicate information and guide you through something. My something is divorce. It used to be celebrity, but now it's divorce. So I am always very clear with my role, but when people sit down and they talk to me, Ilyssa, can my sister call you?
She's going through a divorce. I say, yes, but just remember my role in this. It sometimes amazes me how much I've learned, and I have experts such as you and other experts who come on the show in the column. I'm now out doing panel discussions and speaking engagements, and every day I learn and I write things down because I'm like, Ooh, I didn't know that.
Ooh, that's a good idea for a column. This is something new we need to explore. And I feel every day I get an education in this one topic, there is so much to know, and every day I get to learn something new and share it with other. And to me it's, I think, the greatest gift and the greatest reward.
Paula: Oh, I think you're changing people's lives.
Ilyssa: I hope so.
Paula: Every day you're changing someone's life. I mean, it's hard to make that decision to get divorced, and it truly is an emotional time in your life, and you have this as a resource to go out and find information that was never available before. And I think that's huge.
Ilyssa: Yeah, and not only that, but how to find it, because as I said earlier, when you Google it is overwhelming.
You see the number of pages based on the search words you keyed into that toolbar and divorce is overwhelming. Now this? I think I pulled a huge clump of hair outta my head the first time I did it because it was like, oh my God, stop, is how I felt. I just wanted exactly what I was looking for. It doesn't do that.
And that's what this is. So that's why I try to funnel it the best and easiest way possible. I try to make it very conversational. People are very intimidated to talk about this. I'm not gonna understand. They're gonna ask me questions, I'm not gonna know, oh my God, they're gonna think I'm stupid.
Absolutely not. We all go in this, even the experts, and we're all human. It is very overwhelming. And again, I am gonna comfort you in the best way I know. We are gonna hold your hand and walk you through this. And I think for me, one of the greatest rewards is not only helping people, but I always get choked up when I tell this story. It's my kids.
See, I'm getting choked up now. And they both came to me separately and one of my daughters was telling me how a member of her sports team was talking about her parents' divorce and. I said to my daughter, oh my God. I didn't realize that they were getting divorced. She goes, Mom, they, she was telling us a lot of stuff and I didn't understand why she was doing this.
I said, well, team represents family and sisterhood and maybe she felt she can turn to you guys. I said, being that you know your parents got divorced, did you go over and maybe show your support? Cause that's what she needs. She goes, I did, Mom. You see, I get choked up. And I said, oh sweetie, I'm so proud of you.
What'd you say? She's like, I told her, she and her Mom needed my Mom because my Mom, see, I get choked up. And my other daughter had a similar experience with a bunkmate and she's like, Mom, my friend so and so's parents are going through a horrific divorce. And I said, I'm so sorry. She's just like, please go help her Mom.
She goes, that's what you do. She goes, you help everybody. You gotta help my friend. And see, I get choked up and that's how my kids see this. And to me, there's no greater reward than having that audience see me for what I set out to do. And I didn't know what I was doing when I first did this. I kind of went into this blind.
I just knew there was a void and I knew I had to make a difference.
Paula: I think what you're doing is amazing. I truly do.
Ilyssa: You're making me cry.
Paula: No more crying!
Ilyssa: But it's the impact that it not only has on people, but it's had on my own kids. And we all wanna be good role models for our kids. We all wanna do right by our kids.
And I didn't know how to take a bad situation and make it right for my kids. And I hope that they continue to see the work that I'm so passionate about. Not that they wanna hear the word divorce every single day in their household, but they understand why they're hearing it. And they're hearing it because mommy is out there trying to help other people where we once were.
Paula: Yeah. I think they're not hearing the negativity of divorce, but they're hearing how you are empowering other people going through divorce. And that's a big difference.
Ilyssa: It is a huge difference. And I always try to tell people, and I was just speaking, a few days before we recorded this podcast and I saw this one woman very broken. And I said to her, I was you, I get you.
I understand you. And this is temporary. You probably heard the sun is gonna shine and she started laughing as she's crying. I go, and it will not today. Definitely not tomorrow, and maybe not next month. I said, but it will. And that's the goal you always have to work towards and know that it's temporary.
It Stinks. We are all dealt to something in life. And if this is your something, know that it is gonna pass. Do people. As we say, survive and thrive afte?. Absolutely. I got a new career that I've been building from the ground up. I made new friends. I made and got involved in a whole new line of work and started working with colleagues that I never even knew existed such as yourself.
Some of which have become personal friends off mic, and we've actually gone out to dinners and gotten together and learned more about each other. I mean, what better gift is that? And I found my spirit, and that got lost along the way. And as my mom calls it "my spunk," and she goes, you're spunky again. You're fun again.
You're yourself again. And that's a big thing when you're going through divorce. If you've lost so much of yourself in a bad marriage and a bad situation, you can find it again. And you might be really pleased with the new version of you and I learned that in therapy you will start out on this journey one way and come out completely different.
And different is not always bad. Different can sometimes be better than you ever imagined, and my life in some regards is better than I ever imagined. I still face challenges like everybody else every day, but I think the greatest part is I love what I do. I've learned how to love myself, and I've learned how to be better in so many areas of my life, and it came through my divorce.
Paula: We're very similar in our stories because after what I've gone through, I've changed so much. As a person, my life is totally different, and my kids today look at me and say, Mom, you struggled so much after the circumstances of the divorce and look at you today. We're so proud of you. And I. That just means so much to me to have them say that because I've also seen changes in them from them watching me change.
And to me that's, I don't know what more a parent could want.
Ilyssa: Absolutely.
Paula: So how do people find your information?
Ilyssa: It's really easy. I have a website set up. It's just my first name and last name together, no spaces, IlyssaPanitz.com. Everything is right there. I know we hate the word commingled in divorce, but we commingle everything onto one website, which makes it a little bit easier for people to find.
So it's all the articles. It's the radio show, which after it live streams on Saturday and Sunday becomes a podcast. So it's available there. Past appearances. We're gonna be redoing the website for 2023, so we'll make sure that all the speaking engagements are up there. If people can't be there in person, they can always zoom in.
And again, all I do is I talk to experts and we talk to them about things that are trending, things that are topical, things that I hear and get a lot of questions of, that people would love to hear more from the experts and use these forums to really help people. As I said earlier, gain knowledge and get educated so they could be smarter clients for you, for their attorneys, and again, make those decisions and feel good and confident about the choices they're making for themselves and their children.
Paula: I think your information is great. We'll have the website in our show notes that you can easily find her website. I really appreciate you spending time with me today. You know, I totally adore you, and so anytime we get to chat is always fun for me.
Ilyssa: Oh, I'm so honored. I adore you right back.
Paula: So if you would like to get ahold of me, you can reach me at Paula@paulachristine.com.
Thanks again. I really, really appreciate you being here today.
Ilyssa: Well, I was honored you asked.